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| PentecostalTheology.com
What a local church practices may not be in line with the statement of belief of the denomination or movement. However, generally an affirmation of alignment with the statement of faith is required.~Pastor Terry Wiles
What the Assemblies of God believes?
http://www.ag.org/top/beliefs/statement_of_fundamental_truths/sft_full.cfm#7
7. The Baptism in the Holy Spirit: All believers are entitled to and should ardently expect and earnestly seek the promise of the Father, the baptism in the Holy Spirit and fire, according to the command of our Lord Jesus Christ. This was the normal experience of all in the early Christian Church. With it comes the enduement of power for life and service, the bestowment of the gifts and their uses in the work of the ministry. •Luke 24:49 [KJV/NIV] •Acts 1:4 [KJV/NIV] •Acts 1:8 [KJV/NIV] •1 Corinthians 12:1-31 [KJV/NIV]
This experience is distinct from and subsequent to the experience of the new birth. •Acts 8:12-17 [KJV/NIV] •Acts 10:44-46 [KJV/NIV] •Acts 11:14-16 [KJV/NIV] •Acts 15:7-9 [KJV/NIV]
With the baptism in the Holy Spirit come such experiences as:
•an overflowing fullness of the Spirit, John 7:37-39 [KJV/NIV], Acts 4:8 [KJV/NIV] •a deepened reverence for God, Acts 2:43 [KJV/NIV], Hebrews 12:28 [KJV/NIV] •an intensified consecration to God and dedication to His work, Acts 2:42 [KJV/NIV] •and a more active love for Christ, for His Word and for the lost, Mark 16:20 [KJV/NIV]
8. The Initial Physical Evidence of the Baptism in the Holy Spirit
The baptism of believers in the Holy Spirit is witnessed by the initial physical sign of speaking with other tongues as the Spirit of God gives them utterance. •Acts 2:4 [KJV/NIV]
The speaking in tongues in this instance is the same in essence as the gift of tongues, but is different in purpose and use. •1 Corinthians 12:4-10 [KJV/NIV] •1 Corinthians 12:28 [KJV/NIV]
What the Foursquare church believes?
https://www.foursquare.org/about/what_we_believe
The Baptism of the Holy Spirit: We believe that the baptism with the Holy Spirit is an experience that follows salvation. All believers have God’s Spirit within them. Holy Spirit baptism empowers believers to exalt Jesus, to live lives of holiness, and to be witnesses of God’s saving grace. We believe that those who experience Holy Spirit baptism today will experience it in the same manner that believers experienced it in the early church; in other words, we believe that they will speak in tongues—languages that are not known to them (Acts 1: 5, 8; 2:4).
What the Church of God in Christ believes?
http://www.cogic.org/our-foundation/what-we-believe/
THE BAPTISM OF THE HOLY GHOST: We believe that the Baptism of the Holy Ghost is an experience subsequent to conversion and sanctification and that tongue-speaking is the consequence of the baptism in the Holy Ghost with the manifestations of the fruit of the spirit (Galatians 5:22-23; Acts 10:46, 19:1-6). We believe that we are not baptized with the Holy Ghost in order to be saved (Acts 19:1-6; John 3:5). When one receives a baptismal Holy Ghost experience, we believe one will speak with a tongue unknown to oneself according to the sovereign will of Christ. To be filled with the Spirit means to be Spirit controlled as expressed by Paul in Ephesians 5:18-19. Since the charismatic demonstrations were necessary to help the early church to be successful in implementing the command of Christ, we therefore, believe that a Holy Ghost experience is mandatory for all men today.
What the Church of God Cleveland Tennessee believes?
http://www.churchofgod.org/beliefs/declaration-of-faith
• In the baptism with the Holy Ghost subsequent to a clean heart. • In speaking with other tongues as the Spirit gives utterance and that it is the initial evidence of the baptism of the Holy Ghost.
What the UPCI believes?
http://www.bible.ca/cr-United-Pentecostal-(upci).htm
THE BAPTISM OF THE HOLY SPIRIT
John the Baptist, in Matthew 3:11, said, “…He shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire.”
Jesus, in Acts 1:5, said, “…ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.”
Luke tells us in Acts 2:4, they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues (languages), as the Spirit gave them utterance.”
The terms “baptize with the Holy Ghost and fire,” “filled with the Holy Spirit,” and the “gift of the Holy Ghost” are synonymous terms used interchangeably in the Bible.
It is scriptural to expect all who receive the gift, filling, or baptism of the Holy Spirit to receive the same physical, initial sign of speaking with other tongues.
The speaking with other tongues, as recorded in Acts 2:4, 10:46, and 19:6, and the gift of tongues, as explained in 1 Corinthians, chapters 12 and 14, are the same in essence, but different in use and purpose.
The Lord, through the Prophet Joel, said, I will pour out my Spirit upon all flesh; …” (Joel 2:28).
Peter, in explaining this phenomenal experience, said, having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, He (Jesus) hath shed forth this which ye now see and hear.” (Acts 2:33).
Further, “…The promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.” (Acts 2:39).
Varnel Watson
YES it is Terry Wiles Angel Ruiz Brody Pope
Isara Mo
When a baby is born the first thing it does is cry…nobody understands “that” language.it is the evidence that the baby is alive(or living).
Evidence of a new born child of God?Tongues…tatata..bababa…because his umbilical cord is no longer connected to earth but to God…he utters ” mysteries” like the infant who cries and nobody understands..
Varnel Watson
is right …
Varnel Watson
https://blog.bham.ac.uk/fullgospel/2017/08/10/what-is-pentecostal-theology/
Varnel Watson
true Pentecostalism? What is your take on this? Chris Friend
Chris Friend
I believe that tongues are both the greatest spiritual gift and the least. Greatest because they edify the speaker. Least because they only edify the speaker. So tongues is an essential starting point into an immersed life in the Spirit (ala a Spirit baptised life). My pastoral experience has been to explain the basics to people, tell them to seek and within a short period of time this becomes their experience too.
Chris Friend
Out of interest, is this group Trinitarian (I’m hoping it is)?
Varnel Watson
Chris Friend would YOU say there are OTHER evidences for the baptism too? This group is TRIN though we have tolerated unitarians in the past to some extend http://www.pentecostaltheology.com/?s=trinity
Chris Friend
Troy Day evidences? Or initial evidences?
Varnel Watson
Chris Friend I only believe in ONE evidence as they did in the book of ACTS IMHO
Rick Ferguson
This would seem to be the sign the book of Acts church looked for.
Varnel Watson
I sure agree with this being Pentecostal interpretation
Rick Ferguson
Troy Day do you feel that there is a better interpretation shown in Scripture
Varnel Watson
Rick Ferguson Nope Some have claim it is only initial One of many evidences and more I dont see it In Acts they anticipated this sign In early Pentecostalism tongues was the sign There is nothing more we can add in postmodernity
Varnel Watson
The Evidence of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit
How does a person know if they have received the baptism in the Holy Spirit? Is there any evidence to show that a person has received? Fortunately the Scriptures show us that there is evidence that one has been baptized with the Holy Spirit. In order to demonstrate this we are going to revisit the texts in Acts that were cited in the previous section.
Varnel Watson
whats your take Gawin Jerome Anderson Michael Ellis Carter Jr.
Gawin Jerome Anderson
I’m a believer..
Francisco Arriola
For all the dogmatic glossalalists there is a book published by Hendrickson Publishers (who used to put the latest in Pentecostal thought at an affordable price) written by Henry I. Lederle-“Treasures Old and New: Interpretations of “Spirit-Baptism” in the Charismatic Renewal Movement. It addresses Neo-Pentecostal, Sacramental, Integrative views of how Spirit-Baptism is interpreted in the mainline Charismatic churches (Methodist, Anglican, Catholic). It is not one interpretation fits all, and that is even the case among Pentecostals (see Gordon Fee vs Roger Stronstad). So for the dogmatists, your view is just one of many. The Spirit blows where it wills, and you are not able to lock him in some scheme or pattern. Those who do not hold your interpretation, yet strive to know and serve God as just as much Christians as you are.
Gawin Jerome Anderson
Francisco Arriola how did the apostles know that the Samaritan in Acts 8:4-18 was not baptized with the Spirit?
Francisco Arriola
I am not in total disagreement with the standard position. I am just there are others who are Charismatic or Pentecostal who raise valid points about the text and do not subscribe to the classic position. They still profess to experience the baptism. These are careless interpreters of the text.
Francisco Arriola
I left out the word aware
Gawin Jerome Anderson
Francisco Arriola what is the baptism with the Spirit? And did the apostles know and knew when someone did or didn’t have the baptism with the Spirit?
Francisco Arriola
Por favor Lee lo que escribi en El texto anterior. Gracias
Varnel Watson
this article Gawin has some fundamental theological resources Most if not all early Pentecostals believed in initial evidence It is what set them apart from the Methodist based holiness movement Many of them split from baptist and methodist with that distinctive
During an 1883 meeting in Fairview, Ohio, Maria Woodworth-Etter wrote that the people confessed sin and “prayed for a baptism of the Holy Ghost and of fire.” Fifteen people came to the altar screaming for mercy and fell over in trances In a huge meeting in Alexandria, Indiana, Maria reported that the power of God took control of about 500 of the 25,000 people, causing many to fall to the ground. “The Holy Ghost sat upon them,” she wrote. “I was overpowered. By 1885 Etter had developed a theology that included salvation, holiness, the baptism in the Holy Spirit, healing, and the imminent return of Christ.
http://www.pentecostaltheology.com/historically-and-theologically-first-person-in-america-to-speak-in-tongues-with-holy-ghost-baptism/
Varnel Watson
Irwin taught baptisms of fire, dynamite, lyddite and oxidite For the literally minded, this meant that a baptism “with fire” had followed … of patented chemical perfection: baptisms of “dynamite,” “selenite,” and “oxynite. http://www.pentecostaltheology.com/irwin-taught-baptisms-of-fire-dynamite-lyddite-and-oxidite/
Wangure's Reflections
Do Pentecostals still hold tongues as initial evidence of being filled with the Holy Ghost? I thought this debate was settled when the Assemblies of God changed that language from their theology
Gawin Jerome Anderson
Wangure’s Reflections yes!
Varnel Watson
Wangure’s Reflections are you page – what are you ?
Wangure's Reflections
Troy Day Am Pentecostal pastor in Kenya. I have been for many years. I speak in tongues. But I am not dogmatic about it. I don’t insist it is a sign/evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit.
Ana-Maria Plus Michael
Wangure’s Reflections It’s changing and it depends very much on who you are talking to… but AoG US still does hold that doctrine: https://ag.org/beliefs/statement-of-fundamental-truths#8
A very good book on this mapping both history and current state of this doctrine is Friesen, Norming the Abnormal.
https://www.amazon.com/Norming-Abnormal-Development-Classical-Pentecostalism/dp/1620322366
Wangure's Reflections
Ana-Maria Plus Michael I should get the book and read it
Ana-Maria Plus Michael
Wangure’s Reflections See https://libgen.is/search.php?req=norming+the+abnormal&lg_topic=libgen&open=0&view=simple&res=25&phrase=1&column=def
Varnel Watson
Ana-Maria Plus Michael Error
Could not connect to the database: User ‘libgen-catalog’ has exceeded the ‘max_user_connections’ resource (current value: 40)
Cannot proceed.
Please, report on the error.
Varnel Watson
Ana-Maria Plus Michael I did but still the same Enough with the spam links Just spit it out already Are you a page too? Are you a boy or a girl plus Jesus or what? Free grace like RichardAnna Boyce Joe Absher
Ana-Maria Plus Michael
Troy Day No spam links, just download links. No malware nor ads on those sites.
Btw. this is our combined profile of me and my wife. My name is Michael.
Varnel Watson
Ana-Maria Plus Michael links were dead Possibly blocked by FB as spam or abuse or malware like you said
Ana-Maria Plus Michael
Troy Day Sorry to hear that. That book is simply available at Library Genesis. Please learn more about it here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_Genesis
I don’t think FB blocked my first link above. Just keep reloading that page, it will work.
Varnel Watson
Ashley Faulk Bro B. H. Clendennen got most of his teachings from another earlier teacher Very very sad
Ashley Faulk
Troy Day why is that sad
John Doe
Who would that be?
Josh
Who did BH Clendennen get his teachings from?
George Hartwell
This doctrine might be a good example of how a movement of the Holy Spirit filled with life, miracles, and transformed lives transitions into a dead religious movement controlled by the carnal nature.
Gawin Jerome Anderson
George Hartwell explain please
George Hartwell
The birth of the pentecostal church was in the Azusa Street revival where preachers hid their faces behind crates and people were drawn off the street from blocks away. What happens next can be fast or slow, but man begins to take over, man begins to create man’s order, man’s hierarchy, man’s doctrine and, one more time, the vital movement known as the church, is suppressed as it is pressed into Constantine’s requirements for a religion of Rome: one bishop per city, one unifying doctrine and ‘Sunday clothes. How much does the Holy Spirit care about ‘initial evidence’ as opposed to the vitality of the community which invites the presence of the Holy Dove and lives as an expression of Christ’s love?
Gawin Jerome Anderson
George Hartwell so should we no longer teach? Just go to church and pray for more Christ?
Wangure's Reflections
George Hartwell Brother your perspective is edifying! Speaking in tongues or not does not effect vitality, greater love, God’s presence, and effectiveness of a worship community
George Hartwell
Stop trying to judge whether someone is ‘speaking in toungues’ in order to assess if they received the baptism in the Holy Spirit. If there is any question and someone wants to be baptized then one can pray “fill them again lord.”
RichardAnna Boyce
Ephesians 4:5 There is one baptism. Paul is not dealing with a mode of baptism here, but probably is talking about the baptism of the Holy Spirit which places a believer in union with Christ at the moment of salvation (Rom 6:1-14; 1 Cor 12:13). So the first manifestation is that believers will have assurance that their Eternal Life in Christ is guaranteed.
Gawin Jerome Anderson
RichardAnna Boyce so was the people in Acts 8:4-18 not saved until Peter and John got there?
RichardAnna Boyce
Gawin Jerome Anderson Acts 8:8. Philip’s ministry produced great joy in Samaria, a city where nondeported Jews centuries earlier had intermarried with war captives from other countries resettled in northern Israel by the Assyrians. The spread of the gospel to their mixed culture brings the narrative closer to the reaching of pure Gentiles with the good news about the Savior Jesus Christ. Their great joy reflects both their secure salvation and certain deliverance effected there by God in His grace.
RichardAnna Boyce
Gawin Jerome Anderson Acts 8:14-17
Now, Peter and John would arrive from Jerusalem to facilitate the falling of the Holy Spirit on them (cf. 8:16).
8:15. Thus far only Jewish believers and proselytes had received the Holy Spirit (and none by the laying on of hands). Here Peter and John pray on behalf of the Samaritans. The prayer facilitated the bestowal of the Holy Spirit. The actual reception of the Spirit awaited the laying on of hands by the apostles.
8:16. The Holy Spirit had not yet fallen upon any of the Samaritan believers. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Unlike the Palestinian Jews of Acts 2, the Samaritans did not need to meet any additional condition in order to receive the Holy Spirit. Nevertheless the bestowal by the hands of the apostles would aid in preserving the unity of the Church in these early days. It would also validate the authority of the Twelve and Jerusalem as the source of correct doctrine. This explains both the delay in their reception of the Spirit and the laying on of hands for the granting of the Spirit with them.
8:17. The narrative shows the Samaritans as passive in this process. God had already given them eternal life (regeneration) as result of simply believing in Jesus. Now the apostles laid hands on them (including Simon, whom in v 13 Luke said both believed and was baptized) and they received the Holy Spirit.
These details contradict any interpretation that renders Simon an unbeliever. Luke highlights Simon’s belief (v 13) without differentiating his faith, baptism, or reception of the Spirit from that of the other Samaritan believers.
Gawin Jerome Anderson
RichardAnna Boyce so in vs 14-16 its said the Holy Spirit had not fallen on none of them.. so seeing you are thinking that Believers receive the baptism with the spirit at the moment oh salvation where does this leave them?
RichardAnna Boyce
Gawin Jerome Anderson believers are baptised into the Body of Christ the moment they first believe in Jesus to guarantee them Eternal Life.
Gawin Jerome Anderson
RichardAnna Boyce okay yes I believe that… by one Spirit we are baptized in to one body. Yes this is salvation.. not the same as baptism with the Spirit.
RichardAnna Boyce
It must be remembered that Acts reports a transitional time. The Church was born in Acts 2. However, for a short time after the birth of the Church, people were not baptized by the Spirit into the Body of Christ at the moment they believed. New believers in Samaria (Acts 8) and believing disciples of John the Baptist (Acts 19) were baptized by the Holy Spirit into the body of Christ well after they were born again. Only in Acts 10 and the conversion of the Gentile Cornelius do we see the baptism of the Holy Spirit occurring at the moment of faith.
RichardAnna Boyce
The unusual method by which the Samaritans received the Spirit (through the laying on of the apostles’ hands) prevented schism and rivalry at the very first. Samaritan religion rejected the claims of Jerusalem, but by receiving the Holy Spirit through the hands of the Jewish apostles, the Samaritan converts
are now made to sense their indebtedness to it. Jews despised Samaritans, yet here they both lay hands on and pray for them.
Danny Lirette
RichardAnna Boyce are you writing your comments as “your own” or are you getting this from a secondary source? I’m simply curious. These comments/responses are so … they’re just hitting my heart right now!
RichardAnna Boyce
i am Pentecostal Free Grace non denominational. faithalone.org
Cleston Walton
RichardAnna Boyce concur
Varnel Watson
GOD wants us to speak in tongues about free grace being heretical and all that
RichardAnna Boyce
Troy Day Bible verse please
Varnel Watson
Peter Vandever GOD STILL wants us to speak in tongues
Peter Vandever
Daily.
Varnel Watson
and nightly – “The Baptism of the Holy Ghost is the greatest event in Christian history. Greater than the Crucifixion, of greater import than the Resurrection, greater than the Ascension, greater than the glorification. It was the end and finality of Crucifixion and Resurrection, Ascension and glorification.” John G Lake (possibly the most powerful man of God in Church history).
Until we grasp this fact, that the BHG is the apex highest event in HIStory, we will not understand it is the genesis of our life in fruitful ministry. This baptism is the most important thing you need to make your life count for God and eternity. A Christian without the Holy Spirit fullness is merely academic in his relationship with God. This baptism immerses us into power, potential and experiential knowledge of God and His kingdom. Have you been baptized in the Holy Spirit since you were saved?
Wangure's Reflections
Troy Day God still wants us to be filled with the Holy Spirit, enhance loving relationships, have a living presence, and true vitality of the worship community. This is more important than just speaking in tongues
Varnel Watson
Wangure’s Reflections are you a page? what are you – seems you may not be even pentecostal per se
Varnel Watson
John Duncan what do you mean by We must keep in mind evidence is not conclusive proof. ???
John Duncan
Troy Day evidence is not proof. Evidence needs to be corroborated with other evidences to become proof. Tongues without holiness or power is conclusive that the baptism was not in the HOLY Spirit.
Varnel Watson
John Duncan the BIBLE is NOT enough evidence? There is no Tongues without holiness GOD will not allow it Hence we believe in entire sanctification as Pentecostals
John Duncan
many speak in “tongues” but live unsanctified lives.
Varnel Watson
John Duncan the BIBLE does not lie [period]
John Duncan
Troy Day some Mormons speak in tongues. Are they filled with the Holy Spirit?
Jimmy Pearson
I do not hold that tongues is the initial evidence of Spirit baptism.
Varnel Watson
you shouldnt hold on tongues with plain fingers either
Jimmy Pearson
Haha! I think you know what I mean but funny response.
Varnel Watson
Jimmy Pearson no I dont cause you must be speaking in tongues or something similar
Jimmy Pearson
I do not believe that tongues are the initial evidence of Spirit baptism.
Varnel Watson
Jimmy Pearson then how do you know you got baptized? Someone just told you so and you went with it?
Jimmy Pearson
well to be more specific I don’t believe In second or third works of grace either. A person is baptized into the Spirit when they are saved. It is all received by grace through faith. If I were going to look for evidences then I think the fruit of the Spirit would be a better proof than any gift.
Varnel Watson
Neil Steven Lawrence Francisco Arriola plain and simple
GOT NO TONGUES ? – GOT NO HOLY GHOST
What else is there
Thank you very much
Neil Steven Lawrence
Troy Day saying you don’t want the baptism of the holy spirit is like saying you don’t want a turbo charger in your sports car!
How do anti-second grace people explain Matthew 3:11
“Jesus will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire…“
Francisco Arriola
?
Jimmy Pearson
Taylor Bruney Tongues as initial evidence of baptism in the Spirit. Yea or nea?
Taylor Bruney
I heavily lean toward nay
Jimmy Pearson
Taylor I thought so.
Jimmy Pearson
I’m actually a straight up no.
Taylor Bruney
I am too, tongues is not a fruit of the spirit
Steve Losee
ZZZZZZzzzz………..
RichardAnna Boyce
Matthew 3:10-12 For those who continued trusting their heritage rather than their Messiah and who demonstrated their lack of repentance there was only one prospect—the fire of God’s judgment. Fire was often used in the OT as a symbol of temporal judgment (Isa 10:16-19; 66:15-16; Jer 48:45).
The objects of judgment are depicted as “every tree [that] does not bear good fruit,” and chaff that has been separated from the wheat by a “winnowing fan.” In both cases they are said to be burned with fire.
In Matt 3:11 John proclaims the greatness of the One “who is coming after” him. John, the greatest of the Old Testament prophets (11:11), declares his unworthiness to perform the lowliest task of the lowest slave when he says, “whose sandals I am not worthy to carry.”
Three baptisms are mentioned in Matt 3:11: baptism of “water unto repentance,” baptism “with the Holy Spirit,” and baptism with fire. Each signified initiation into a new situation.
The baptism with the Holy Spirit by the King was yet future. It would initiate and characterize the Church Age by bringing Jews and Gentiles together into the same body (1 Cor 12:13; Col 1:18). It began on the Day of Pentecost (cf. Acts 1:5 with 11:15-16).
The baptism with fire alludes to the fiery temporal judgment that unbelieving Israel will experience.
RichardAnna Boyce
Acts 2:4-13. Languages originated in the dispersion of the nations at the tower of Babel (Gen 11:1-9). The Jewish race, exhibiting the same pride and self-will as the nations, was similarly dispersed when Jerusalem, like Babel, was destroyed. Hence they participated through dispersion in the Gentile confusion of tongues.
The question, “whatever could this mean?” (Acts 2:12) finds its answer in the sign character of the gift of tongues (1 Cor 14:20-22). Tongues were expressly given as a sign to the Jewish people of God’s power and willingness to overcome the effects of their dispersion. The Jews from the many nations represented here might have been re-gathered according to Old Testament promise had they believed in Jesus as the Messiah. These Jews were ideal representatives of the dispersion, being devout men (v 5) and from every nation under heaven (v 5). It was an ideal occasion for the presentation of this offer, yet—although 3000 were converted—increasingly the nation rejected God’s offer of grace and re-gathering. Hence, to this day, Israel’s Babel-like dispersion (actually initiated by Babylon) continues and the Jews of the world are still to be found speaking the many tongues of the nations. But, though Israel refused to be gathered, God is gathering others nonetheless (John 11:52).
Modern claims to the gift of tongues lack evidence that the gift is being used for its stated purpose as a sign to Israel (1 Cor 14:20-22).
Though the baptism of the Spirit evidently occurs here, it is not specifically mentioned. None of the phenomena are synonymous with it. (Nor need these be repeated when a soul is so baptized. If it is wrong to insist that one being baptized with the Holy Spirit hear a noise of wind, or see a tongue of fire, it is also wrong to insist that he must speak in tongues.) The baptism of the Spirit, here as well as in our experience, is invisible—unseen, unfelt by human sense, totally supernatural. It is important to see that it was so from the first.
Had the special, supernatural events here recorded not taken place, the disciples might never have realized that it was then that the promise of the baptism was fulfilled. They might have been baptized without knowing it. We do not need these signs now, for we believe we have been baptized by the Spirit on the basis of the Word of God. These were but the tokens and evidences of the Spirit’s presence. The central message to us of this passage lies, not in the unique and special sign-gift of tongues, but in the power of the Spirit to transform timid men and women into bold witnesses of the Savior.
The special manifestation of the Spirit’s presence here was not the unseen baptism, but Spirit-filled men speaking in languages otherwise unknown to them. This filling seems both here and elsewhere in Luke/Acts to be mainly a sovereign work of the Holy Spirit by which the filled person becomes His mouthpiece (cf. esp., Luke 1:41, 67; Acts 4:8, 31; 9:17 with 9:20; 13:9).
The filling of the Spirit is distinct from the baptism, yet related. An empty glass submerged (baptized) in water will be filled by it. So here, although they are waiting for the baptism specifically (cf. Acts 1:5), yet when it comes they are filled (2:4). They were empty of self, open to God, waiting on Him in prayer, united in heart (2:1), and thus ready to be filled. Filling is an experience especially to be expected of those who are submerged in the Spirit. Though supernatural and sovereignly bestowed, it nevertheless comes upon prepared vessels.
Note how Peter has scarcely begun to speak when he begins to pour forth the Scripture. The quoted passage, verses 17-21, is the longest quotation of Old Testament in Acts. Note also verses 25-28 and 30, 31, 34, and 39 for quotations or allusions to the Word. The Apostle is full of the Spirit and hence full of the Word. The experience recorded here finds illustration in John 2:1-11. For 3 1/2 years, and then intensively for 40 days (1:3), our Lord had filled the stone water pots of their hearts with the water of His Word, supplied through His servants the prophets. Now on the day of Pentecost the mysterious miracle occurs and the water of the Word is transformed into the wine of the Spirit. The joys of salvation are partaken of by 3000 on that day. “These men are full of new wine.” Wrong, yet right. They were full of the new wine of the Spirit freshly poured out from heaven (cf. Luke 5:37-39).
Varnel Watson
so do you not speak in tongues? RichardAnna Boyce
RichardAnna Boyce
no, but Holy Spirit does through me when He wants to
Varnel Watson
RichardAnna Boyce I knew it – calvinist who dont speak in tongues Oh well
RichardAnna Boyce
Troy Day Free Grace gives glory to Jesus, allowing Holy Spirit to talk through a believer, and doesnt put emphasis on the believer being able to do it herself.
Francisco Arriola
For all the dogmatic glossalalists there is a book published by Hendrickson Publishers (who used to put the latest in Pentecostal thought at an affordable price) written by Henry I. Lederle-“Treasures Old and New: Interpretations of “Spirit-Baptism” in the Charismatic Renewal Movement. It addresses Neo-Pentecostal, Sacramental, Integrative views of how Spirit-Baptism is interpreted in the mainline Charismatic churches (Methodist, Anglican, Catholic). It is not one interpretation fits all, and that is even the case among Pentecostals (see Gordon Fee vs Roger Stronstad). So for the dogmatists, your view is just one of many. The Spirit blows where it wills, and you are not able to lock him in some scheme or pattern. Those who do not hold your interpretation, yet strive to know and serve God as just as much Christians as you are.
Francisco Arriola
For all the dogmatic glossalalists there is a book published by Hendrickson Publishers (who used to put the latest in Pentecostal thought at an affordable price) written by Henry I. Lederle-“Treasures Old and New: Interpretations of “Spirit-Baptism” in the Charismatic Renewal Movement. It addresses Neo-Pentecostal, Sacramental, Integrative views of how Spirit-Baptism is interpreted in the mainline Charismatic churches (Methodist, Anglican, Catholic). It is not one interpretation fits all, and that is even the case among Pentecostals (see Gordon Fee vs Roger Stronstad). So for the dogmatists, your view is just one of many. The Spirit blows where it wills, and you are not able to lock him in some scheme or pattern. Those who do not hold your interpretation, yet strive to know and serve God as just as much Christians as you are.
Varnel Watson
is it FREE? Ken Hagin WHY tongues is pdf free 🙂
Varnel Watson
Gawin Jerome Anderson Jim Price Jimmy Pearson Peter Vandever So to be Pentecostals nolonger mean to believe that the baptism with the Spirit is with tongues? #WRONG
Jimmy Pearson
Troy I’m not sure how Pentecostals define Pentecostalism. I am not in a Pentecostal Church at the moment and have not been for a while. I know when I was in a Pentecostal Church even when I was an intern at one there was a wide variety of Views on tongues as the initial evidence. My pastor at that time who had been Pentecostal his whole life didn’t believe tongues was the initial evidence. Yet we had many people who did. I’m not sure who has the authority to define what it means to be Pentecostal. It makes little difference to me as I no longer consider myself truly a Pentecostal I do consider myself a continuationist and a cautious one at that but not Pentecostal.
Varnel Watson
Hey Jimmy long post short response – in your case if you dont speak in tongues you aint saved Ask Peter Vandever
Jimmy Pearson
Troy I would need chapter and verse on that. But I’m 100% sure there’s not one.
Jimmy Pearson
PS. I have spoken in tongues I don’t regularly but I have. Though I am wrestling with the precise definition of biblical tongues
Varnel Watson
Jimmy Pearson I tagged you on few posts Lets talk about it
Peter Vandever
Troy Day you do not have to pray in tongues to be saved but you very well might need to pray in tongues to stay saved.
Varnel Watson
Peter Vandever you need tongues to know Vicki Mart is an ol troll Probably not even a woman either
RichardAnna Boyce
Peter Vandever saved by grace only, through faith only, in Christ only plus tongues?
Varnel Watson
RichardAnna Boyce I think Peter Vandever was saved by speaking in tongues unlike you perhaps?
Byron Benefield
Clendennen took the whole idea for SOC from Theodore W. Austin-Sparks was born in London, England in 1888 The SOC curriculum was taken 1:1 from the School of Christ Book written by T. Austin Sparks. We thank God for the life and legacy of Brother Sparks and this revelation of the School into which Jesus brings every true disciple. We believe that apart from the Bible this is the best book ever written for the basic principles of true Christianity.
http://www.austin-sparks.net/index.html
Anonymous
yap Link Hudson NOT a single case in the BIBLE …
Anonymous
Troy Day of what?
Anonymous
1 Corinthians 12:27-31 (KJV) 27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. 28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. 29 [Are] all apostles? [are] all prophets? [are] all teachers? [are] all workers of miracles? 30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? 31 But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.
If speaking in tongues is the initial evidence, why not other gifts instead?

Prophecy, preaching the gospel with boldness, words of knowledge, healing by the laying on of hands. Love for others that wasn’t there before.
Could those be accepted as evidences of being baptized by the Holy Ghost?
Because I do know of some who have experienced all those things but yet, has never received the gift of speaking in tongues.
Anonymous
Brett Dobbs alike Link Hudson you are conflicting, confusing and confuting the initial evidence of speaking in tongues with the GIFT of speaking in tongues BOTH Bishop Bernie L Wade and Melvin Harter have explained the difference before. There is a need of reading 1Cor in the original Greek uncorrupted by Jerome/Erasmus sources within the KJV in order to see the difference cleverly We did it years ago with Link Hudson which he remembers
Anonymous
Troy Day so are you saying there is the initial evidence of speaking in tongues at the baptism of the Holy Ghost. But after that happens. One may not have the gift of speaking in tongues? But later on may receive the gift of speaking in tongues?
I’m really not trying to argue here. I really am trying to figure this out.
If it’s a hidden meaning in the Greek, please explain it to me.
Anonymous
1 Corinthians 12:30-30 (NASB20) All do not have gifts of healings, do they? All do not speak with tongues, do they? All do not interpret, do they?
??
Anonymous
Brett Dobbs Not according to Apostle Paul.
Anonymous
Bishop Bernie L Wade is the baptism of the Holy Ghost manifested in other spiritual gifts such as words of knowledge and prophecy, and preaching the gospel with boldness?
Anonymous
Brett Dobbs you mix and match the BIBLE text GET at least a good Greek interlinear and look it up – you are mixing the evidence of HSB with the gift of speaking in tongues. Did they speak in tongues in the OT?
Anonymous
Troy Day not to my knowledge. Neither was anyone preaching the gospel with boldness. Neither was anyone saved by the Holy Spirit onto salvation the same way that Christians are saved. By the sealing of the Holy Spirit. There was prophets in the OT who had the anointing of the Holy Spirit. But to my knowledge neither was anyone spirit filled either.
Anonymous
Here’s my Interlinear. Or you could just break it down for me.
Anonymous
Troy Day I remember. Um no. I don’t read everything you tag me on.
Anonymous
Troy Day speaking in tongues is in I Cor 14 and in Acts. The Bible doesn’t say if they are the same or different. It doesn’t mention ‘initial evidence’.
Anonymous
Mark 16:16-16 (KJV) He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Is this baptized by water or the Holy Ghost?
Anonymous
Tongues is an evidence of the baptism. It’s not the only evidence because many gifts are listed and in 2 Corinthians 12 it says that not all speak in tongues.
However in the book of Acts the day of Pentecost tongues was a verifying sign that the Holy Spirit was breaking into people groups: 1. The Jews. 2. The Gentiles. 3. The Samaritans. At that point in history in the historical inclusion of people groups into Christ it was the initial evidence of the spirit’s baptism.
I think this is where some Christian groups tend to fall on one side of it saying that that ( evidence of cultural and racial inclusion) was the only reason that existed, ( tongues) and then other groups tend to fall on the other side of it saying that that reason that it existed at that time is to be applied to every person. (As the sole initial evidence.)
Neither of those I think are the cut and dried reasons for the initial evidence of speaking in tongues in the book of Acts as everyone would have it.
At the Azusa Street outpouring speaking in tongues prophecy word of knowledge and the other revelatory gifts begin to operate in full swing and have followed the teachings of Pentecost all around the world,… Still not all speak in tongues.
Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Are all workers of miracles? Do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?
I Corinthians 12:29-30 NKJV
https://bible.com/bible/114/1co.12.29-30.NKJV
Anonymous
what is your main arguement here Brett Dobbs Kyle Williams WHAT in the BIBLE is NOT clear that you have tongues and gift of tongues ? >
Anonymous
Troy Day the baptism is = to Regeneration at every single point and passage of scripture. The baptism equates to the new birth in such way that it cannot be denied. In essence, if the Pentecostal is to remain consistent, he must teach that xenoglossy is the sign of Regeneration and doubt the Regeneration of all who have not manifest the sign of previously unknown languages.
And if he will not he must know that he is treading on 2000 years of Christian tradition that says that the Baptism of the Holy Spirit is Regeneration.
Anonymous
Kyle Williams tell what you really think about TONGUES
Anonymous
Troy Day Tounges ceased to be the normative practice of the Church at the end of the Apostolic Era. The period of Revelation ended, therefore the revelatory gifts ceased. This is not to say that Sovereign God could not extraordinarily bestow this supernatural ability upon a man who is witnessing to someone who speaks a different language, which is what tounges was in the Apostolic era.
Anonymous
Kyle Williams oh dear GOD NO – what are half billion Christians in the world doing right now then? TerryandNita Wiles William DeArteaga
Anonymous
Troy Day something that scripture knows nothing of.
Anonymous
Kyle Williams so you deny the BIBLE now – OK !
Anonymous
Troy Day why? Isn’t it plain that the languages spoken of in scripture could be interpreted, meaning that it was a intelligible language?
Anonymous
Kyle Williams glassolalia is VERY miuch in the BIBLE
Anonymous
Oscar Valdez Philip Williams are you even PENTECOSTAL ?
Anonymous
Troy Day I’m a full pentecostal-arminian-disp-pre-trib-!! 😅
Anonymous
Oscar Valdez you cannot be FULL pentecostal if you dont weight over 300lb brother
Anonymous
Kyle Williams glassolalia is VERY miuch in the BIBLE Oscar Valdez
Anonymous
Troy Day yes and it was a language
Anonymous
Troy Day I do really want to have a good discussion on this topic. To be honest I’m fairly new to Pentecostalism. I new to the continuation of the gifts of the spirit. And how it all works. So if you or anyone would be willing to have a dialogue with me, or anyone else , and allow me to offer some push back on some areas where I have un answered questions.