RESPONSE to Steve McSwain’s 6 Things Christians Should Just Stop Saying

Posted by David M. Hinsen in Facebook's Pentecostal Theology Group View the Original Post

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/2767507
Here’s a great read…

Edwin Mendez [07/09/2015 11:33 PM]
Seems like someone has been reading a lot of Bart Erhman. If so, give Daniel Wallace a chance.

James Armstrong [07/10/2015 12:57 AM]
I can’t say I agree with this article at all.

Edwin Mendez [07/10/2015 1:35 AM]
I disagree as well. To tell someone ” that’s your interpretation” is to imply and endorse that no human who reads the Bible can obtain or recognize objective truth which is an agnostic notion which admits that objectivity is elusive and impossible to subjective humans. This is a contradictory notion. It is also to endorse that the Bible consists of nothing explicit enough to conclude any objective truth as well which is completely false. This seems like the type of individual who promotes a Frederick Nietzche-like relativism towards truth which we all know contradicts itself. Unless you don’t mind committing logical suicide and thus committing yourself to incoherence then I’d have to say beware of the line of thinking promoted in this article. I can further explain how this line of thinking is erroneous and a contradiction, however it is something I’ll do only at request.

John Ruffle [07/10/2015 4:07 AM]
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MY IMMEDIATE RESPONSE TO AN OUTRAGEOUS ARTICLE:

SWAIN SAYS: “You can still revere the Bible, my friend, but move beyond the prejudice of Paul or anyone else. You don’t need to make Saint Paul infallible to treat the Bible as important.”

— So Steve McSwain’s take on life simply discounts Paul the Apostle. IF Swain was not claiming to be a Christian, then let him say anything he likes. The PROBLEM is that he considers himself “Christian”, as evidenced here:

SWAIN SAYS: “There are scores of Christians, however, and I am one of them..”

— NO, by identifying himself as a ‘Christian’ Mr. Swain has actually made himself a heretic by definition. He has even condemned himself in these words a little earlier:

SWAIN SAYS: “You are entitled to your opinions, your assumptions, even your beliefs. What you are not entitled to is a misrepresentation of the facts.”

— This is actually what he has done in mis-representing himself as a ‘Christian’. Whatever else he may be, he frankly IS NOT a Christian.

SWAIN SAYS: If you want to believe that Genesis is a scientific description of the origins of the universe, then have at it. Just stop insisting that those myths be taught in our public schools. You do no service to the Bible nor to the morality of this country by demanding school administrators include textbooks that teach that nonsense or by demanding courts hang the Ten Commandments on chamber walls or classroom walls.”

— “..those myths..”; “..teach that nonsense..” – WHO gave McSwain, who appears to wallow in his toleration of any and all religions and practices however godless, the right to JUDGE those and cast out of hand those who chose to believe the Genesis account?

— This is the spirit of the age, a deadly spirit that has infected entire denominations across the world. We need to recognize it for what it is. I was planning a “6 Things Christians Should Believe’ in response, but time has escaped me. I’ll leave it for other good Brothers and Sisters in Christ to respond this heretic’s article.

By the way, some may feel threatened or question of my calling McSwain a heretic. But I simple DO NOT SEE any other way of describing his beliefs. They are NOT in accord with the Biblical teaching (which he despises anyway) and not in accord with the historic teaching of the Church Universal (or catholic) of Jesus Christ.

– John Ruffle, 10th July, 2015.

Dan Woods [07/10/2015 6:48 AM]
Liberal theology presented with humility is one thing, but abrasive, arrogant liberal theology presented with condescension is quite another. This is more than one man or even the HuffPost telling us to “Just Shut Up!” It is the rising tide of our culture.

John Kissinger [07/10/2015 7:41 AM]
David M. Hinsen I’m just hoping they didn’t teach you this article in school Alan N Carla Smith

William Dicker [07/10/2015 8:18 AM]
This article is blasphemy and sickened me to read it.

John Kissinger [07/10/2015 8:22 AM]
yap – there’s a 7th thing to add. If you stop saying all these 6 you can also stop saying #YOUareSAVED

David M. Hinsen [07/10/2015 9:45 AM]
For clarification, when I say, “here’s a great read”, there are 3 periods behind that statement which should denote sarcasm. I find the guy almost contradictory in some cases as John Ruffle points out.

David M. Hinsen [07/10/2015 9:47 AM]
And no, I wasn’t taught this in school. I attend Lee University which offers a very good education. 🙂

David M. Hinsen [07/10/2015 10:02 AM]
And just to be very clear, I’m a Church of God pastor (Cleveland, TN) in VA who is very conservative.

John Kissinger [07/10/2015 10:04 AM]
I wrote an article not long ago (St. Thomas’ Sunday) called “Be a believer not an unbeliever,” which was Jesus’ command to Thomas. In expose, there’s so much we are being told NOT to believe. Don’t’ believe the rapture, baptism with the Spirit, free will, gifts of the spirit, apostolic ministry, women in ministry, etc. (I’m sure I’m missing a few). There’s so much we’re told NOT to believe that if we stop believing it there’ll be very little left to believe. Now The Huffington Post is telling is what NOT to say. Jesus said: go, and when you get there SPEAK (speak up, preach, proclaim, confess) and through that make disciples (followers, students, committed to the Message). Sure the world would not like what we’re saying but I think we should listen to the article David M. Hinsen has offered us and say exactly these 6 things (plus many more Biblical truths) we’re forced not to say for whatever political, ethnic, ethical and otherwise conformist reasons. The GOSPEL must be said, spoken forth, preached, proclaimed and announced!

John Ruffle [07/10/2015 10:09 AM]
Compasses can be great to check direction. We usually think of a compass pointing ‘north’ and we follow.. in this case, we’ve got a really accurate reading.. but the needle’s the wrong way around and is directing us south. Follow the exact opposite and we’ll be fine! 😉

William Dicker [07/10/2015 10:09 AM]
Revelation predicts an apostasy….. a great falling away before the return of our Lord…. this is only the beginning of that falling away. Look at how many Christians are supporting our leadership in the White House. How can you call yourself a Christian and support the laws being forced upon us by our legislation?

John Kissinger [07/10/2015 10:11 AM]
Just to confirm, I know David M. Hinsen and he does not approve of the article. Disapproval of the article may have been communicated better via “great” being in quotes, but still a great topic to be brought to the attention of this group. Thank you David M. Hinsen

John Kissinger [07/10/2015 10:38 AM]
John Ruffle On the point of #COMPASS God’s abiding place is described as up north (The NKJV Study Bible, p.826 footnote on Job 37:21-22, Ex. 34; Is. 14:13 https://books.google.com/books?id=h12HBAAAQBAJ&pg=PA826&lpg=PA826&dq=god%27s+abiding+place+is++north.&source=bl&ots=Jfhop0BQZz&sig=AUK3MrO8Mjrhnqb6010MdoFtluM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=v9efVbLqBYvSoATUwbCwBg&ved=0CC4Q6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=god’s%20abiding%20place%20is%20%20north.&f=false). As the church reached Europe, the New Testament gives a clear movement toward North West – Rome and Spain. Moves toward the North have been present in the evangelization of Eastern Europe during the Byzantium period, as well as later North Eastern moves of Christianity toward Russia. Apostolic Faith (February – March, 1907) speaks of the “wonderful work of God going on in the West” (http://cupandcross.com/the-apostolic-faith-february-%E2%80%93-march-1907/). In 2002 P. Jenkins introduces 3 arguments in favor of the South:
1. Christianity will be dominated by churches in the Southern hemisphere
2. Southern Christianity is conservative, fundamentalist and traditional
3. Understanding Christianity requires understanding Southern Christianity (http://cupandcross.com/the-next-christendom/)

John Kissinger [07/10/2015 10:45 AM]
I was gonna ask Jayson Bradley for a good response today, but seems like John UpChurch has already beat us to the point with his “6 Things Christians Must KEEP Saying” http://www.crosswalk.com/blogs/christian-trends/6-things-christians-must-keep-saying.html

John Kissinger [07/10/2015 12:36 PM]
Thank you indeed John UpChurch I love how you’ve included our important Pentecostal heritage of the #RAPTURE in pint #4 although point #5 seems more important for our times. But point #4 the #RAPTURE is more important for our future and all of the times in #ETERNITY

John Ruffle [07/11/2015 1:42 AM]
Interesting how the un-saints mock most of all our belief in the beginning narrative and the end narrative both of which carry clear biblically recorded teaching. Yet Jesus is the Alpha and the Omega.. so those who renounce the Biblical record are renouncing Christ Jesus.

Personally, I don’t concern myself with rapture theory. Jesus IS returning This is the core eschatological truth, that all orthodox Christians agree upon. “He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead.” On the other hand there us no consensus of opinion on rapture theory – at best it’s a secondary doctrine, and in the face of heretics, it’s best we keep quiet on it – at least in front if the heathen and heretics.

John Kissinger [07/11/2015 5:49 AM]
Thank you indeed John UpChurch I love how you’ve included our important Pentecostal heritage of the #RAPTURE in pint #4 although point #5 seems more important for our times. But point #4 the #RAPTURE is more important for our future and all of the times in #ETERNITY

Alan N Carla Smith [07/11/2015 1:09 PM]
So […] denotes sarcasm?
Hope and Eternity…
Hmmmm…
Wonder if that’s a Lee College thing…?

David M. Hinsen [07/11/2015 1:24 PM]
Alan N Carla Smith, Lee University has some wonderful people their that I’m sure could answer that for you, just give them a call.

Alan N Carla Smith [07/11/2015 9:41 PM]

David M. Hinsen [07/11/2015 10:02 PM]
Yes, yes it should. Auto Correct isn’t as much of an orthographer as we humans can be.

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