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The Rapture
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Philip Williams
Nonsense! How can an event announced by trumpets be secret?
Isara Mo
Philip Williams
//And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
Matthew 24:14 KJV//
Has THIS gospel of the Kingdom been preached in all the world for the trumpets to be sounded?..
There is a DIFFERENT gospel being preached in the world today so until THIS gospel of the Kingdom is preached, rapture is not there yet.
Philip Williams
Isara Mo bingo
Isara Mo
Philip Williams
People talk of rapture as if it us some sport, a kind of a future entertainment…a festival of sorts…
The scriptures don’t say it is a day of candy and chocolates….
The one to rejoice is the one who is ready, prepared, and knows that they are “qualified”…
An encounter with a living God is not an encounter with a US President…
Philip Williams
“Woe to you who long for the day of the Lord! Why do you long for the day of the Lord? That day will be darkness, not light. It will be as though a man fled from a lion only to meet a bear, as though he entered his house and rested his hand on the wall only to have a snake bite him. Will not the day of the Lord be darkness, not light— pitch-dark, without a ray of brightness? “I hate, I despise your religious festivals; your assemblies are a stench to me.” Amos 5:18-21
Varnel Watson
TRUTH – the rapture is nonsense for the ones who are not ready for it But it will be very real once they become left behind
Philip Williams
Troy Day I hope to be left behind because Matthew 13 shows the ones taken are burned with fire.
Varnel Watson
Philip Williams my understanding is that this topic is very very fragile
Philip Williams
the rapture theory is certainly about to break.
RichardAnna Boyce
Matthew 24:29-31
24:29-30. “Immediately after the Tribulation” the earth will experience severe dread at widely seen cosmic disturbances when Jesus comes to judge and cleanse the earth (Luke 21:25-26). Foreboding signs in the skies will precede “the sign of the Son of Man” when He comes “on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.” A sign precedes the appearing of the Son of Man. The light of all heavenly bodies thus dimmed (Joel 2:31; 3:15), will increase the impact of the manifestation of the glory of Christ. “The powers of the heavens” that might compete with His display of power “will be shaken” (Rev 6:12-13). Thick, heavy darkness will bring extraordinary gloom to the inhabitants of the earth. In the now deeper blackness of space the Shekinah glory, which emanates from Christ, will appear at last (cf. Matt 2:2,9). This sign will be viewed with alarm as it swiftly approaches earth. The dreadful harvest will have begun (cf. 13:47-50; Rev 14:14-20).
He will descend as He had previously ascended in the sight of the disciples––visibly, bodily, and with clouds (Acts 1:10-11; cf. Matt 26:64 and Dan 7:13). In Scripture the presence of a cloud or clouds signifies the presence of God, the heavenly origin, destiny, and character of the messianic King, the manifestation of God’s glory, and on occasion the judgment of God (Ex 13:21-22; 16:10; 40:34-38; 2 Chron 5:13-14; Isa 19:1; Dan 7:13-14).
“All the tribes of the earth will mourn” in response to the visible power and glory of this unparalleled event (v 30; cf. Zech 12:10). To suggest that these words refer figuratively to a nonliteral “coming of Christ” to destroy Jerusalem in AD 70 does injustice to the context and to the ultimate victory of God in human history. The parting of the Red Sea as a climax of previous miracles was a literal, spectacular deliverance for Israel and a stupendous judgment on Egypt, their oppressors (Ex 14). When all Israel turns to Christ in the end times and is saved, could there be any less a demonstration of miraculous power on earth than that wielded by the King of kings and Lord of Lords (Rev 19:16)?
24:31. The harvest of the saved will begin with an exercise of royal authority. Jesus will dispatch “angels to gather the elect,” God’s chosen people, Israel (cf. Isa 27:12-13; 65:9). Israel is now scattered to “the four winds” (i.e., the remotest parts of the earth in all directions) because of her disobedience (Deut 28:64-67; Ezek 37:21-22; Luke 21:24), but then she will be placed in her land (Isa 11:11-16; Jer 16:14-15; Ezek 37:21-22,25; 39:27-28). As a trumpet was used in ancient Israel to call Israel to assemble (Num 10:1-10), so a trumpet will announce the gathering of Messiah’s people at His coming. It no doubt will celebrate a great military triumph and deliverance as well (cf. Zech 9:14-16). At this point Israel’s time of tribulation will be over because the nation will have been rescued (Matt 24:13). The use of the trumpet may indicate that Jesus’ coming will be heard as well as seen.
Since the Church will have already been caught up in the Rapture and gathered to Christ prior to the Tribulation (1 Thess 4:13-18; 5:9), this gathering does not apply to them. The last trumpet of the Church Age mentioned in 1 Cor 15:52 is not the same as the trumpet described here. This trumpet is blown at the end of the Tribulation.
In most of the following series of illustrations and parables, Jesus draws contrasts between those who are faithful, prepared, and watchful and those who are not. The outcome is reward or retribution.
Varnel Watson
Philip Williams when you say rapture you think dispensation The moment you deliver yourself from this misconception will be enlightening
Philip Williams
Troy Day I think 2 grinding at the mill, 2 sleeping in a bed.
Varnel Watson
Philip Williams you lack Pentecostal understanding of the Mt 24 narrative I assumed you already have RichardAnna Boyce has proposed an interesting read that explains well 99.9% the olive narrative in relation to the church in a relatively Pentecostal way
What Pentecostal read which Pentecostal author on actual Pentecostal eschatology have you studied to make these assumptions and somewhat judgment (which I dont mind because iron sharpens iron) BUT if you are going to make global conclusions on the subject shouldnt you first study the subject in Pentecostal history and theology?
BTW what did your Pentecostal grandmother believe? I can say with certainty that EVERY Pentecostal AG cog grandmother represented here believed in pre-Trib rapture – which settles it
Philip Williams
Troy Day actually opposed the ‘saved, sanctified, baptized with the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues, filled up, prayed up and ready to go up.’ Saw that as a neglect of what God is doing with his latter day church, his bride.
Philip Williams
Troy Day I don’t bother to read RichardAnna Boyce’s bags of hot air.
Joshua Morris
The thing I have agsnist the rapture they say the holy ghost will be gone and people will get saved. How will they without the holy ghost
Varnel Watson
Pentecostal pre-Trib do not say that This is the claim of Dallas BTS dispensation Pls re-read carefully Darby and Dake – they dont say that at all Dake claims the church is the restrainer Only Larkin in 1919 claimed the departure of the Holy Ghost Baptists picked that up but soon realized none will be saved with out the Spirit present on earth Theres been great discussions in this group explaining that well
Jerome T Morris
Joshua Morris
This is crystal clear- vs 1 speaks of the day of the Rapture then it says let no man deceive you for that day ( rapture) will not happen until WE ( Christians ) will see the Antichrist sit in the Temple claiming to be God.
Joshua Morris
Jerome T Morris yes so true
Varnel Watson
I would NOT claim anything about the Rapture without FIRST examine it myself to be for sure Appreciate Philip Williams not going low ball to claim pre-Trib rapture was not around till 1800s Anyone affording that particular low ball will be a slam dunk for me http://www.pentecostaltheology.com/the-ancient-church-fathers-believed-in-pre-trib-rapture/
Jerome T Morris
2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
Varnel Watson
Give us your interpretation Jerome T Morris
Jerome T Morris
Troy Day
It’s simple, we will see the Antichrist sit in the Temple before the Rapture.
It’s crystal clear! There’s no other Interpreting that passage of scripture
Varnel Watson
Jerome T Morris Not so simple – the ones in the rapture shall se NO Antichrist or Temple built yet
Jerome Herrick Weymouth
Well according to some…when the antichrist sets up the peace tready with Israel, thus allowing the rebuilding of the temple, then the rapture happens or it happens were the antichrist take his place inside the Holy of Holies… now heres a wrench thrown in… the Mercy seat… is that the bema seat or the seat of Moses? Is that why it is important for the antichrist to sit there?
Jerome T Morris
Troy Day
That’s a Fairytale
Jerome T Morris
No where in the Bible does it support pre-trib.
In order to come up with that theory you have to bend, twist and add to scripture.
Jesus told us exactly what will happen to us in Matthew 24 and He didn’t hold anything back.
Point blank He said they will hate you and kill you for my name sake and you will go through the greatest tribulation of all tribulations.
Then Jesus says, IMMEDIATELY after the tribulation will He return.
Jesus is not returning but one time.
If that’s not enough Daniel breaks the last days down very well. He makes it clear the Antichrist will wage war against the SAINTS.
Need more evidence?
Read the book of Revelation, again the Bible is crystal clear that the Antichrist will wage war against the SAINTS and cut our heads off.
Jeremiah and Isaiah’s back up Daniel Matthew chapter 24 and a book of revelations that Christians Will be persecuted during the final tribulation
Varnel Watson
I dont know that Jerome agrees with Jerome here
Varnel Watson
Chris Westerman you seem to suggest that engaging in a bitter ‘culture war’ in order to preserve America’s formerly dominant Christian culture has been largely a failed strategy but I will submit that you may be too late for any of that