CAN a demonized person deliver him/her self

CAN a demonized person deliver him/her self
Posted by in Facebook's Pentecostal Theology Group View the Original Post

CAN a demonized person deliver him/her self from
the demons on their own?
Do we have a Biblical example of self deliverance?

93 Comments

  • Reply December 23, 2018

    Guest;

    I’ve had to bind and command demons to leave me before and I would start yawning and and tearing up and horrible spit. So I would say so, I’ve been told before that can do deliverance on yourself, some call it spiritual warfare

  • Reply December 23, 2018

    Guest;

    Any biblical models?

  • Reply December 23, 2018

    Guest;

    Satan can’t cast out Satan

  • Reply December 23, 2018

    Guest;

    Jesus is the delieverer. Holy spirit helps

  • Reply December 23, 2018

    Guest;

    The Devil showed Jesus demonic visions. Jesus quoted scripture to the Devil and the Devil left Him. On another occasion, He said, “Get thee behind me Satan.”

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Hezekiah was under a sentence of death, he cried the wept he prayed. God heard him and delivered him.
    David too he agonized in prayer. More than once. And sick unto death from the sounds of it.
    And the hebrew boys, Daniel too and Esther, they was all under a death sentence. You may say they was alright, meaning their spiritual condition, but when death is foul and murderous, be sure that old devil sticking his nose in where it don’t belong.
    And you may as well say pornography or drinking or lying is death. Isn’t that right? sin will kill you sure as cigarettes and getting behind the wheel drunk. Many a soul fell asleep drunk and woke up in hell. Don’t kid yourself repent while you still can

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Any biblical example ???

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Isn’t there a sin that leads to death for which we should not pray?

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    which one would that be? any ideas of 7 mortal sins

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Peter, Paul, Solomon, David, Samson, should i continue.

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Not self deliverance but Jesus. You give no credit to Jesus. Why?

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    yes you should with specific BIBLE verses

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Casting out can only be done thru the power of Christ so….it’s HIM that’s does it.

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    What about my venial sins and fibs

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    If Jesus could save us without us even hearing the gospel thanhe could deliver us too

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    yes Daniel J Hesse why you give no praise to Jesus 🙂

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    With every breath I give Him all the praise, honor, and glory!!!

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Veniel and mortal sins are a device of man all sin deserves death

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    When I surrendered and called upon the name of Jesus the demon within me left me. There was just me and the Holy Ghost no other person. I cannot find specific scripture for support but I know it happened.
    When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
    Matthew 12:43‭ KJV

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    There is one verse in the Bible that would make me say no. That’s where He said satan Can’t cast out satan. I think it’s in John 1st chapter where it says Judas by transgression fell.

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Mark 3:23. How can satan. AST out satan.

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Here is the question I wanna ask? Are you asking everyone here cannot daemonic possessed person deliver them selves from all the demons? I’m not trying to be rude or disrespectful. I’m not even trying to ask a stupid question here? I am dyslexic so I’m trying to comprehend your question before I answer it

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    No

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    No

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Paul L. King there seems to be an overwhelming response in this discussion saying No is the right answer; however, given some experiences and your expertise, it will be beneficial for many to hear your Scriptural stand on on this issue. It also may help to discuss TB Joshua with his theology and praxis in a separate post as his influence in deliverance ministry in Africa and some of Europe is pretty strong

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Demons are no greater in Africa than anywhere else. I am not guessing, I have been there. No one can cast a demon out of themself. It doesn’t even make sense. How would you cast a demon out of yourself? The topic is obviously being driven from novices. I have been in deliverance with people who could not even pray because every time they tried one of the demons cried out! This is not some trivial topic. I don’t know TB Joshua, but I do know that I have been in his area of the country and I have way more questions than I see answers from him. That is the view from my porch…

  • Reply December 24, 2018

    Guest;

    Just curious how Jesus taught about deliverance.

  • Reply December 25, 2018

    Guest;

    I did.

  • Reply December 25, 2018

    Guest;

    I’ve read about supposed ‘alien abductions’ that were cut short when the victims would rebuke the ‘aliens’ in the name of Jesus or call on the name of Jesus.

  • Reply December 25, 2018

    Guest;

    Nelson Banuchi what kind of demon was it?

  • Reply December 25, 2018

    Guest;

    The answer is no they cannot. I personally have had done daemonic deliverances out of people in Brazil and also America. Nobody even in scripture that a person can deliver them selves out of demons either.

  • Reply December 25, 2018

    Guest;

    Isara Mo NO – to what?
    that there is NO deliverance at all
    that a Christian cannot be demonized?
    that one cannot cast a demon from themselves ?

  • Reply December 25, 2018

    Guest;

    No human can deliver anyone form a demon. Only the power of God can deliver ANYONE for the power of satan. SO the answer to the question is NO!

  • Reply December 25, 2018

    Guest;

    First of all if a person is has demons in them they are not saved or born again, so no they can not deliver themselves.

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    As I have stated already I have done myself personally daemonic deliverances including healing. But it’s not by my power or not that I’m any special either. It’s true God using me to help deliver that person from the demons. Man himself cannot take on Satan by no means. We are no match against Satan on are own. It’s only through the power of the Holy Spirit it also being born again that we can take him on.

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    No dobt it is JESUS who ultimately delivers BUT how can a person who is demonized delivered on their own by Jesus? Wouldnt that disregard the whole point of deliverance ministry ?

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    We miss the responsibility we have in helping the delivered to thoroughly furnish their houses. Cleaned and empty leaves the delivered in a place of greater vulnerability. Maybe, this is the place of discipleship?

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    You were right on when you say that as well. What you’re stating is so true and I love it

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    the BIBLE says demonized – not possessed which is a KJV deviation and has messed up half of the Western world

    is there a Scripture that says, “if a person is has demons in them they are not saved or born again.”

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    I wonder if we misunderstand the term born again here in America in the 21st Century

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    I wonder if we understand the term demonized fully

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    9 Types of Deliverance (maybe more)
    Type 1: Deliverance from sin/hell—salvation by Jesus
    • Col. 1:13—He delivered us from the authority (exousia) of darkness)
    • 1 Thess 1:10—delivered us from the wrath to come
    Type 2: Prayer for deliverance: “And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil”—Matt 6:13 Total dependency on God as the source and power of deliverance
    Type 3: Cast off the old way of life (Eph. 4:22, 25)
    • Falsehood —Eph 4:22
    • bitterness & wrath & anger & clamor & slander be removed [airō] from you, along with all malice—Eph 4:31
    • “anger, rage, malice, slander, filthy talk—Col 3:8
    • the works of darkness (Rom. 13:12)
    • every weight (Heb. 12:1)
    • “filthiness & rampant wickedness” James 1:21
    • all malice and all deceit and hypocrisy and envy and slander of every kind,–1 Peter 2:1
    Type 4: Rebuking sin, demons
    • rebuke works of darkness—Eph 5:11
    Type 5: Binding and loosing—Matt 16:19
    • Binding spirits
    • Loosing from bondage
    • Binding strongman—Matt. 12:29
    Type 6: Cast down (2 Cor. 10:3-5)
    • Strongholds
    • Imaginations
    • Every high thing exalted against God
    Type 7: Bring every thought captive to the obedience of Christ—2 Cor. 10:5
    Type 8: Cast out (ekballo) of yourself
    • log out of your own eye– Matt 7:5
    • if your eye causes you to sin, throw (ekbale it away)”—Mark 9:47
    Type 9: Cast out evil spirit (with help of others if necessary)

  • Reply December 26, 2018

    Guest;

    Perhaps the illustration of a roach infestation will help understand the concept of the possibility of demons within a believer and “self-deliverance” vs. deliverance through others: Roaches may infest a house. They don’t own the house. But they can cause uncleanness and havoc in the house. You can spray the house (self-deliverance). But if the infestation is too severe, you may need to call in an exterminator.

  • Reply December 27, 2018

    Guest;

    No we cannot delieveryyouur self .

  • Reply December 27, 2018

    Guest;

    Onde estou??

  • Reply December 28, 2018

    Guest;

    ARE they possessed or oppressed?

  • Reply December 28, 2018

    Guest;

    I cover this topic along with several others in my new book-

    You can pre-order it now-

    https://www.amazon.com/Casting-Out-Devils-Supernatural-Deliverance/dp/0768448379

  • Reply December 28, 2018

    Guest;

    Fastinf

  • Reply December 28, 2018

    Guest;

    Chad Macdonald since we are not going to buy your book just give us the brief version here brother

  • Reply December 29, 2018

    Guest;

    Paul L. King I believe a believer cannot be “infested”. There is a hedge about me. The Holy Spirit is within me. I am a Child of God. The flesh may urge me to get outside the hedge but I’m following the still small voice that says “this is the way, walk in it.”

    The sinner may be infested but this temple of the Holy Spirit cannot be.

    INFESTED in British – adjective: invaded by parasites
    Example
    The prison is infested with rats.
    Collins English Dictionary. Copyright © HarperCollins Publishers

  • Reply December 29, 2018

    Guest;

    I FOR on dont see it happening
    Yes any person COULD and should pray for Jesus to deliver him/her BUT a fully demonized person like I’ve seen them I just dont see it happening – its like saying that a crack addict can kick the habit on their own – it could be I just havent seen it yet Joe Absher

  • Reply January 2, 2019

    Guest;

    Demons cant cast out demons

  • Reply October 4, 2019

    RichardAnna Boyce

    no, an unbeliever is delivered by the DELIVERED ONE the moment they believe in Jesus to guarantee them eternal life. As a believer they can never be demonised.

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      Isara Mo

      RichardAnna Boyce
      Disagree completely with the two of you.
      I agree that an UNBELIEVER can’t deliver themselves or orhers
      as witnessed in the case of the sons of Sceva but need Jesus IN THEM to exercise the RIGHT to cast out a demon(demons) in themselves.
      Eternal life doesnt guarantee demonic detoxication..that is why the Bible tells the believer to work out their salvation.
      A man with a tummy goes to a gym to work out the fat in them..I dont see ANYWAY how the tummy go away without a workout..
      A believer needs to work out his salvation including demonic de toxification ..

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      RichardAnna Boyce

      Isara Mo a demon cannot exist inside the spirit of a believer; because a believer is filled with Holy Spirit the moment they believe. Agree that a demon can trouble a believer; but answer is not detoxification/ deliverance, but renewing of mind. We believers live/work out our salvation FROM deliverance not TOWARD deliverance.

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      RichardAnna Boyce

      we focus on, and rest in, the finished work of THE DELIVERER; not focus on, or work on, improving ourselves.

    • Reply October 6, 2019

      Isara Mo

      RichardAnna Boyce
      May I tentatively ask your view(s) of what is the FINISHED WORK OF THE DELIVERER?…
      Perhaps a correct answer to that question may help me understand my misconceptions or skewed ideas of demonolgy…
      Does a believer become SINLESS at conversation? I mean is he or she washed TOTALLY OF HER OR HIS SINS at conversation?
      If the answer is YES then why sanctification?
      If the answer is NO then the Holy Spirit does co exist with sin and if sin is of the devil or from the devil then co existence of light and darkness in a human.being is very real.
      Why IMPROVE YOURSELF when the work is finished?
      Improve from what to what…?

  • Reply October 4, 2019

    Varnel Watson

    RichardAnna Boyce Robert Borders Rico Hero I am glad to see you taking issue on this OP though I am still waiting on your NIV comments to come up as I took quite the time to study you copy paste posts

    This current OP comes with a case study we;ve been looking at along with Joe Absher Paul L. King and Isara Mo recently of a lady who is taking over a church with testimony of self deliverance which we except Isara Mo have come up to doubt quite a bit I will await their responses before submitting this weeks developments in the case study as I am also awaiting your comments on the NIV topic soon

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      RichardAnna Boyce

      i replied on NIV. I prefer to use NKJV and sometimes AMP. I have only read problems with NIV, and copy pasted what i’ve read. I dont know any greek, and don’t know difference between greek and turkish 🙁

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      RichardAnna Boyce none of the links in your replies were working so the discussions stopped there with about 5 questions waiting on you https://www.facebook.com/groups/pentecostaltheologygroup/permalink/2461198373935163/

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      RichardAnna Boyce

      ok you can go to faithalone.org and go to search, type in NIV, and read them there

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      RichardAnna Boyce there is no such site
      This site can’t be reached

      faithorg.com’s server DNS address could not be found.
      DNS_PROBE_FINISHED_NXDOMAIN

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      RichardAnna Boyce

      Troy Day sorry im sleepy after red fruity wine with dinner 🙂

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      RichardAnna Boyce you need to read my comments under the NIV post – your site dont open period

  • Reply October 4, 2019

    Shane Bellamy

    No they require Jesus. Nobody can deliver themselves or anyone it has to be done in Jesus name.

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      Isara Mo

      Shane Bellamy
      When a believer has migraine he prays a short prayer ” In the name of Jesus you spirit of migraine go…”
      Isnt that self deliverance?..
      On a higher note when we do mass deliverance whereby a minister leads a congregation in a prayer point session with words like..” You demon(unclean spirit) from my father/ mothers household affecting my finances, out in the name of Jesus…” is indicative and proof of self deliverance..
      There is an old clip by Win Worley whereby he leads the church in a mass deliverance prayer and there are so many demonic manifestation and casting out..
      That is SELF DELIVERANCE..
      I really dont see any valid scriptural point in urguing against the case..

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      Shane Bellamy

      Isara Mo “For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.” Matthew 18:20 (KJV)

      Can’t do it without Jesus granted authority. Therefore it is not self deliverance.

      It is deliverance in the name of Jesus.

      The demons obey the authority of Jesus. Someone who is present that speaks in the name of Jesus. It can be yourself or another person.

      “And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;” Mark 16:17 (KJV)

    • Reply October 6, 2019

      Isara Mo

      Shane Bellamy
      I think the question should have been re phrased like this ”
      Can a believer in Jesus deliver himself (by own prayer)of his demons?..
      That would have resolved a lot …

    • Reply October 6, 2019

      Shane Bellamy

      Isara Mo yes it would have!! but the question wasn’t asked like that!!

  • Reply October 4, 2019

    Varnel Watson

    Joe Absher you know about the case study as much as we know and waiting its development The NEW this week is that after not attending for awhile and asked on FB as of why the person has promised to return on Sunday At the same time the church announced testimony service planned It will probably contain the persons testimony of new self deliverance Isara Mo jezebel in church @ its best

  • Reply October 4, 2019

    Joe Absher

    The church that’s alive
    .. is worth the drive

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      a cliche is sign for decay and the very reason for nepotism

    • Reply October 8, 2019

      Joe Absher

      🙂

  • Reply October 4, 2019

    Paula Young

    Fast and pray

    • Reply October 4, 2019

      Isara Mo

      Paula Young
      Fast pray ..cast out the demon

  • Reply October 5, 2019

    Varnel Watson

    more info to come soon …

  • Reply October 6, 2019

    RichardAnna Boyce

    Isara Mo CHANGE OR EXCHANGE?
    Religion teaches that to be accepted by God we must change first.
    God’s word is not change, but exchange. On the cross a wonderful exchange took place. Our sin was imputed to Christ and He bore its wrath; and God’s righteousness in Christ
    was imputed to us, by faith. Our identity is that we are righteous.

    Even when we fall into sin our identity does not change.
    Why? Because our identity is not based upon what we have done, or what we do now, but upon who Christ is. God does not judge us on our merits, but on the merits of His Son.

    Religions teach that sanctification leads to justification, Christianity reverses that. Justification, which is by grace through faith in Christ, is the key to sanctification.
    He “justifies the ungodly” (Rom.4:5 NKJV), then we have Holy Spirit power to be holy.

    The first few chapters of the epistles to the Ephesians, Romans and Colossians tell
    believers who they are in Christ.
    Then on the basis of our new identity, we are exhorted to walk worthy of our calling/status. Christian counselling should communicating the truth of the believer’s identity in Christ.
    Knowing this truth will set counselees free to walk in victory and obedience.

    Rom 6 moves from positional truth to practical truth. Position always leads to possession. Position needs to be explained and understood before appropriation can take place.
    Being “in Christ” means being joined to Him, or, made one with Him. “baptised into Christ”

    The consequence of the believer’s spiritual union with Christ is that we partake with Him in His death, burial and resurrection (Rom.6:3-5). Christ’s identity is now ours.
    When He died we died with Him. God has no program for behaviour modification.
    Since we received our sin nature and sin status by birth, we can only lose it is by death.

    We were also buried with Christ, removed from the kingdom of darkness and sin’s power. Having “died to sin” (6:2) does not mean Christians do not sin. We are also still tempted.
    They are no longer slaves to the dominant power of that kingdom, which is sin.
    “You are no longer under the control of the power of sin. Christ has set you free! You are free not to sin. You can choose not to sin.”
    “For he who has died has been freed from sin” (Rom.6:7 – NKJV). “For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace” (Rom.6:14 – NKJV).

    Christ never stayed in the tomb, likewise we were raised with Him to newness of life Ro 6:4. We now live in a new spiritual realm called “the kingdom of the Son of His love” (Col.1:13). We have turned “from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God” (Acts 26:18 ). In the kingdom of light another power to sin rules in this kingdom, the power of grace.

  • Reply October 6, 2019

    RichardAnna Boyce

    CHANGE OR EXCHANGE?
    Religion teaches that to be accepted by God we must change first.
    God’s word is not change, but exchange. On the cross a wonderful exchange took place. Our sin was imputed to Christ and He bore its wrath; and God’s righteousness in Christ
    was imputed to us, by faith. Our identity is that we are righteous.

    Even when we fall into sin our identity does not change.
    Why? Because our identity is not based upon what we have done, or what we do now, but upon who Christ is. God does not judge us on our merits, but on the merits of His Son.

    Religions teach that sanctification leads to justification, Christianity reverses that. Justification, which is by grace through faith in Christ, is the key to sanctification.
    He “justifies the ungodly” (Rom.4:5 NKJV), then we have Holy Spirit power to be holy.

    The first few chapters of the epistles to the Ephesians, Romans and Colossians tell
    believers who they are in Christ.
    Then on the basis of our new identity, we are exhorted to walk worthy of our calling/status. Christian counselling should communicating the truth of the believer’s identity in Christ.
    Knowing this truth will set counselees free to walk in victory and obedience.

    Rom 6 moves from positional truth to practical truth. Position always leads to possession. Position needs to be explained and understood before appropriation can take place.
    Being “in Christ” means being joined to Him, or, made one with Him. “baptised into Christ”

    The consequence of the believer’s spiritual union with Christ is that we partake with Him in His death, burial and resurrection (Rom.6:3-5). Christ’s identity is now ours.
    When He died we died with Him. God has no program for behaviour modification.
    Since we received our sin nature and sin status by birth, we can only lose it is by death.

    We were also buried with Christ, removed from the kingdom of darkness and sin’s power. Having “died to sin” (6:2) does not mean Christians do not sin. We are also still tempted.
    They are no longer slaves to the dominant power of that kingdom, which is sin.
    “You are no longer under the control of the power of sin. Christ has set you free! You are free not to sin. You can choose not to sin.”
    “For he who has died has been freed from sin” (Rom.6:7 – NKJV). “For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace” (Rom.6:14 – NKJV).

    Christ never stayed in the tomb, likewise we were raised with Him to newness of life Ro 6:4. We now live in a new spiritual realm called “the kingdom of the Son of His love” (Col.1:13). We have turned “from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God” (Acts 26:18 ). In the kingdom of light another power to sin rules in this kingdom, the power of grace.

  • Reply October 6, 2019

    RichardAnna Boyce

    Appropriating God’s Grace
    There are four key words Paul uses in Romans 6 that enable counsellors to share with others how to appropriate the grace of God, and so to walk in victory over sin.
    Know (Rom.6:3) Believe (Rom.6:8) Reckon (Rom.6:11) Present (Rom.6:13)

    1) Know. “Do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ were baptized into His death?- that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection” (Rom.6:3-5).
    We must know a truth before it can set us free.
    Paul also prayed that the saints would receive a revelation of them (see Eph.1:15-23).

    As counsellors we need to ask those we counsel:
    “Do you know the powerful truth of being in union with Christ?
    Do you understand that you died and were buried with Christ, and that this delivered you out of the realm where sin reigned?
    Do you know, too, that you were raised to a new life in Christ and that you now live in another spiritual kingdom where grace (God’s ability in the place of your inability) is available to you for every need you will ever have?”

    We must take time to explain it repetitively so they understand it to get a revelation of it.
    Knowing these things is the first step to victory.

    2) Believe. “Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him” Rom.6:8
    Jesus has two ministries on earth and heaven. We were saved by believing in what Jesus accomplished for us during His earthly ministry, i.e. His death and resurrection.
    We will only know freedom from sin and the power to live righteously,
    when we believe in His heavenly ministry seated on the throne of grace supplying grace
    and strength to help in time of need to all who come to Him in faith (Heb.4:16).

    Whenever we show a client how Christ is the answer to his need, if he continues to talk about his problem he is, at that moment, an unbelieving believer.
    He believes Christ for his salvation, but not for his present needs.
    When he ceases to focus on his need and focus on Christ he becomes a believing believer.
    Sadly, there are many
    unbelieving believers looking for someone to justify his right to feel the way he does.

    The Holy Spirit works through biblical counsellors to bring the counselee to a place of trust in Christ for all his needs. The just live by faith. Christ is our life (Col.3:4). and as we run the race that is set before us we are to look unto Jesus
    who is the author and the finisher of our faith (Heb.12:1&2).

    3) Reckon. “Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin,
    but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord” (Rom.6:11 NKJV).
    Reckon means ‘to conclude; to deduct; to make a proper Scriptural assessment of yourself’.
    “consider” ourselves to be who and what we are, and to live accordingly.
    The Bible says we are dead to the reign of sin, and we must live as such.
    When in the kingdom of God, live as kings no longer slaves, but sons and daughters of God.

    4) Present. “Do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin,
    But present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead,
    and your members as instruments of righteousness to God” (Rom.6:13 – NKJV).
    Our bodies, like those of unbelievers, are mortal (Rom.6:12). They are subject to death. They have not yet come under the redemption of Christ (Rom.8:23; Phil.3:21).

    This leaves us with a problem: our new nature is living in an old body.
    The body is not evil. It is not the source of sin, but it is the organ sin uses to manifest itself.
    Though sin remains in our body, our new nature is not under sin but under grace.
    Our new nature enables us to check sin in our body and prevent it from reigning there.
    Sin may be as enticing as before, but it no longer reigns over us.
    If we sin now it is because we choose to sin, not because we have to (1 Cor.10:13).

    On the basis of our new position in Christ and of our freedom from sin’s power,
    we are to present the members of our bodies as instruments of righteousness.
    Through these four keys of knowing, believing, reckoning and presenting,
    the Christian counsellor is able to share the dynamic truth of the believer’s victory over sin.

    • Reply October 6, 2019

      Paul L. King

      This is typical Keswick holiness teaching taught by Watchman Nee, Jessie Penn Lewis, J. Hudson Taylor, and others, but they also cast demons out of believers. Most famous is Hudson Taylor’s deliverance of Pastor Tsi’s wife, and Penn-Lewis’s controversial book “War on the Saints.”

    • Reply October 6, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      well now NOT just Keswick now

    • Reply October 6, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      free grace seems to have adopted a LOT of the wrong things in Pentecostalism

  • Reply October 6, 2019

    Nelson Banuchi

    You’ve asked this before, haven’t you.

    I’ll just briefly say that, if personal experience is any indication, I’d have to answer “yes” to the OP question.

    • Reply October 7, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      we introduced the topic along a NEW case study – have you got the chance to read it yet?

    • Reply October 9, 2019

      Nelson Banuchi

      Troy Day Haven’t read it. Where is it? I don’t see anything on the Pentecostal Theology website…

    • Reply October 9, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      you dont see ANYTHING? 🙂 with 7,000 posts and 50,000 discussions you must see SOMETHING 🙂

    • Reply October 9, 2019

      Nelson Banuchi

      Troy Day I thought it was an article I was to read. I’m not gonna read through all that!

    • Reply October 9, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      Nelson Banuchi I posted a brief REcap for you just below Scroll Read Comment

  • Reply October 9, 2019

    Varnel Watson

    Isara Mo I still saw NO on this one – and the case study proves to me that no matter how much they testify the demon is still there

    I would like to REcap for Nelson Banuchi who was late for class again

    Joes case study didnt indicate the lady had ANY ILL MOTIVES and perhaps she didnt even know she had demons but by what happened at the door I might politely say the “things inside of her” ie the powers of darkness in her might have been very malicious such that God had to block her before she mixed herself with the congregation.
    Strong witches do have covers for themselves and only the Lord or the really annointed servants of God can arrest or expose such as these..
    Some demons are very smart and depart their victims when enter church and wait until.they leave church to re enter them.
    Possibly the lady in Joes case study didnt know they had reached the militarized zone..?

    THIS IS WHAT we know from the case study by Joe Absher in a more orderly way under this post asking the questions
    1. spiritual warfare – do we fight such or do we live
    2. can we accept and allow just any such without deeper review just to justify church growth initiative
    3. which gift has more weight – knowing the spirit or gift of wisdom in action to operate in the situation and protect the flock
    I’ve seen many cases where the person gets slammed at the church door arrested by the Holy Ghost who does not permit them to enter the sanctuary all and while church folk aint got a clue no more
    Its the old question can a Christian have a demon. Been tossed back and forth here for years.
    A lady, 6 months ago comes to church –
    The Holy Ghost slams her at the door – she never entered the church sanctuary. starts jerking – her husband says its seizure’s but it was clear it was a demon.
    she never shows up again. until months later – all dressed up – asks for the mic right off the bat to testify.
    Say’s she was oppressed not possessed because Christians cannot be possessed.
    but she could feel the demon spirit. She was always depressed. never wanted to come out of the house. for months.
    friends went to visit a week ago – prayed anointed her with olive oil – she has been saved for 30 years but never filled with the spirit FELT she was filled with the spirit right then.
    testified in church prayed for people laid hands jumped all over the place screamed at the alter saying revival has already come. should she be allowed to do that?

    Paul L. King then clarified
    Demon, mental illness or both. I have seen them all. We had an incident in our church just a few weeks ago. A young man came in, was worshipping the Lord, hands raised, holding a Bible, then fell, hitting a table, then starting shouting the Lord’s Prayer, then as he was being escorted out of the church by a male nurse an an EMT in our congregation, he was shouting he was a prophet of God. An ambulance carried him off. Didn’t have opportunity to minister to him, but later found out he has some drug background and his brother died 6 weeks earlier, so it appeared to be a combination of drugs, psychotic break, and demonic.

    Isara Mo then responded to
    Blessed be bother Joe and even more blessed Doctor King for always keeping afloat such a very important subject…

    The 3 questions posted above and the case studies of Doc King and Brother Joe show that a person has a responsibilty for their own spritual.growth which is foundational for the whole church growth.In the process of personal growth fights” an own warfare…I think is a very important part of getting to a higher level of ” fighting” warfare OUT OF HIM..or battling the forces of evil in the spritual realm.
    A lifestyle of personal holiniess and divine knowledge and impartation of the same to other members would see the involvement of church in spritual warfare.
    Lifestyles only are not enough .There need to fight.There is cause to fight but as you have posted the question of HOW TO FIGHT remains elusive.
    We might have many many schemes and plans and “strategies warfare” teachings which are ” human.based or quasi spritual” which may have no effect at all against the kingdom.of darkness.
    So it boils down to the third question posted…Whither best GIFT?
    An overview of the Book of Acts of the Holy Spirit not of the apostles show that ALL SPRITUAL GIFTS ARE NEEDED…in the spritual warfare..and church growth..
    Yes a church CAN GROW without any shots fired ie without any spiritual wars…

    IMO Even Link Hudson would agree THAT a jezebel spirit should NOT be allowed to profit prophetically from the church AND I am not merely saying this but drawing directly from one of his many posts on prophecy where he explains how the gift of gift of tongues is prophecy or something similar in his video which I cant find on the internet any longer but am quoting from memory until he posts again

    • Reply October 10, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      Nelson Banuchi I see you took no time to study the case Maybe I should listen to Isara Mo and present it in bulleted style for all to understand it – life LIFE it is NO simple matter

    • Reply October 10, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      Joe Absher I may do it as a separate topic too but NOT before we setup William DeArteaga with his blog this week

  • Reply October 10, 2019

    George Hartwell

    Lots of theory.

    • Reply October 10, 2019

      Varnel Watson

      give us the practical way out pls

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