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| PentecostalTheology.com
You may NOT be Pentecostal IF:
- You have not had a communion service in the last 3 months?
- You have not had a foot washing service within the past 6-12 months
- You talk more about the offering, than you speak in tongues from the pulpit
- If you had not have even one newly saved in your church the past month
- If you are more postmillennial than premillennial
- If you are more Calvinistic than Armenian
- If you believe God preordained you to be this way, instead of continuously striving for sanctifying holiness
Varnel Watson
some people are just not pentecostal and some are bapticostal Joe Absher
Joe Absher
And some are just acostal
Varnel Watson
being a bapticostal makes you a non Pentecostal in my book
Joe Absher
Does the eye say to the ear, I have no need of thee? I’m not trying to be smart just try to remember you’re up there I’m down here looking for allies and soldiers willing to get in the fight for the souls of men. You keep the doctrine straight and clean and biblical. I’ll try to follow along but I just got in
Tyler Garner
I have never been involved in or had a foot washing servixe at the assembly i attend but i am pentecostal, by experience, not denomination.
Varnel Watson
but you never had the experience either…
Tyler Garner
Troy Day the experience of Pentecost took place in the upper room. It is to be endued with Power from on high to witness and live Holy lives. The initial physical evidence is to speak in another tounge. That is what Pentecost is, and as pentecostal believer, i seek the spirit daily, and continue to be full of Him.
Varnel Watson
Tyler Garner OK? have you experienced foot washing
Tyler Lee Price
1. Foot washing is not a sacrament and therefore is not a requirement.
2. The Eucharist should be partaken of each meeting, not just once per quarter.
3. It is not useful to either the body or the individual to “speak in tongues from the pulpit” so how about no.
4. Premillennialism is not a requirement for Pentecostal practice.
5. You do not have to be Armenian to be Pentecostal.
6. The gathering/assembly is not a place for evangelism. Evangelism should take place outside the gathering. If you’re having people consistently saved within your church, your congregants are probably lacking in discipleship.
7. Number 7 is just a restatement of #6.
Varnel Watson
are you saying its not true? Tyler Lee Price
Tyler Lee Price
im saying the content within the post is untrue, yes.
Varnel Watson
Tyler Lee Price how is any of what you are saying Pentecostal? How can a reformed calvinist be Pentecostal? is there Teaching a Calvinists to Dance in the Spirit ???http://www.pentecostaltheology.com/teaching-a-calvinists-to-dance-in-the-spirit/
Charles Page
You have to be Armenian to be Armenian! I have some
Armenian friends who are Pentecostal.
Varnel Watson
how can you be a reformed Pentecostal ? Tyler Lee Price thats a BIG no go right there Joe Absher
Tyler Lee Price
Troy Day Pentecostalism isn’t defined by free will or meticulous sovereignty. It’s defined by spirit-empowered ministry and personal holiness.
Charles Page
Meticulous sovereignty?
Varnel Watson
Hold on a minute Tyler Lee Price HOW can you have personal holiness.without that person having a free will On what choices would personal holiness be based? You contradict yourself for the lack of knowledge Joe Absher
Tyler Lee Price
Can God not foreordain some to conform to His standard of holiness and not others? Calvinists believe in free will, just not LIBERTARIAN free will. They believe we have spontaneous free will.
I’m not Calvinist btw. I adhere to open theism.
Varnel Watson
mayve Henry Volk can explain LIBERTARIAN vs free will. I was under the impression ALL calvinisits were LIBERTARIAN until now
Joe Absher
Thank you reading and following along.
..these aren’t the types of arguments I get 🙂
Varnel Watson
I’ve never met a Calvinist in his own will
Joe Absher
Do they own their own mind?
Steve Losee
“Armenian” is a nationality. “Arminian” is a theological perpective. I know, I’m a nitpicker…
Varnel Watson
Steve Losee I like armenian arminians
Varnel Watson
on LIBERTARIAN free will Charles Page LIBERTARIAN free will means that our choices are free from the determination or constraints of human nature
BUT calvinators believe that anyway – they believe human choices are FREE from human will and nature and under the constrain of GOD 🙂 hence TULIP
Tyler Lee Price I think you may be arguing compatibilism and not very well either I am for now lost @ your reasoning
Charles Page
Troy Day perishing in hell is a free human determination
Varnel Watson
Charles Page well YES and NO for when we open the question of Adam and Eve even calvinators believe they were created with free will
Tyler Lee Price
Troy Day I’m gonna make a video explaining why you’re wrong.
Varnel Watson
Tyler Lee Price wrong about what? I am simply asking a question you cannot answer [yet] You’d do better making a video explaining your own [non]Pentecostal view
Tyler Lee Price
Troy Day what exactly are you even asking?
Varnel Watson
I asked several questions
Scroll up start from the top
Read and answer
Here is a basic one
how is any of what you are saying Pentecostal?
Charles Page
Troy Day of course they were born with free will
They were not created to sin it was rebellion
Varnel Watson
Charles Page I have it from a good source Tyler Lee Price received the HS in his free will Now did he speak in tongues via free will only he can tell ya
Charles Page
Troy Day God gives the utterance
Tyler Lee Price
Troy Day
Varnel Watson
Tyler Lee Price this makes very little sense AND still dont answer my very very simple question I perceive as most Pentecostal students thou hast the gift of avoidance
Tyler Lee Price
Troy Day
Compatibilism is simply the view that God can know the future in its entirety and people still have free will.
Armenians believe in compatibilism. God knows the future, but we still retain free will because our choices are made by our own libertarian volition. (Roger Olson, Armenian Theology)
The only difference between a Calvinistic view and an Armenian view is that Calvin believed that God paved the road and we simply drive on it.
It’s Libertarian free will vs. Spontaneous free will (Terrence Tiessen, Providence and Prayer)
Pentecostal ministry and practice is not defined by our view of foreknowledge or providence. It is defined by spirit empowered ministry and personal holiness.
A Calvinist would belief that God paved the path for him or her to become holy and to be empowered by the Spirit, and therefore does not conflict with any Pentecostal doctrine.
Foot washing, according to scripture and church history, is not a sacrament that we are to practice, and therefore, to state that “your church may not be Pentecostal if you haven’t had a foot washing service in the last 6 months” comes across to me as arrogant and unlearned.
Paul states in 1 Cor. 14 ““For one who speaks in a tongue speaks not to men but to God; for no one understands him, but he utters mysteries in the Spirit. On the other hand, the one who prophesies speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation. The one who speaks in a tongue builds up himself, but the one who prophesies builds up the church. Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up. Now, brothers, if I come to you speaking in tongues, how will I benefit you unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or teaching?
So with yourselves, if with your tongue you utter speech that is not intelligible, how will anyone know what is said? For you will be speaking into the air. There are doubtless many different languages in the world, and none is without meaning, but if I do not know the meaning of the language, I will be a foreigner to the speaker and the speaker a foreigner to me.
Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray that he may interpret. For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays but my mind is unfruitful.
Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue. Brothers, do not be children in your thinking. Be infants in evil, but in your thinking be mature.
If, therefore, the whole church comes together and all speak in tongues, and outsiders or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are out of your minds?
But if there is no one to interpret, let each of them keep silent in church and speak to himself and to God.”
1 Corinthians 14:2-6, 9-11, 13-14, 19-20, 23, 28 ESV
So with the quoted scripture, do you think it’s fruitful to speak in tongues from the pulpit? My answer is absolutely not, and to say that’s a requirement for a church to be Pentecostal comes across to me as arrogant and ignorant of pentecostal doctrine.
I think communion should be done weekly, because it’s scriptural an it’s historical within the church. But again, the frequency of communion does not define Pentecostal ministry and practice.
I personally think that evangelism has no place within the pulpit. I think that should be reserved for TEACHING the Word and instructing the body of Christ so that they may be edified and exhorted to be molded and shaped into the image of Christ by the Spirit, therefore, if people are coming to your church to get saved, your church is probably failing in discipleship and failing in preparing your congregants to go to the world and reach the lost.
My entire argument isn’t based on what I’m saying being Pentecostal or not, my whole point is to prove that the content within the article is not Pentecostal at all simply because those things do not define Pentecostal life, ministry, or practice. I’m surprised the Ph.D in Historical Theology couldn’t discern that.
Varnel Watson
Tyler Lee Price a lot a talk but still not answering the question You’ve got on some rabbit trail of yours again
Tyler Lee Price
Troy Day I can’t believe that you’re still having trouble discerning the fact that I’m telling you the answer in my “rabbit trail”. I’m telling you that what I’m saying isn’t either Pentecostal or non-Pentecostal simply because those things do not define pentecostal ministry or practice.
The things within the article aren’t Pentecostal because those things do not define Pentecostalism either.
How hard is that to understand?
Varnel Watson
Tyler Lee Price early pentecostals practiced foot washing – not practicing it makes you non Pentecostal #there
Tyler Lee Price
Troy Day but does that DEFINE Pentecostalism?
Varnel Watson
Tyler Lee Price early Pentecostals believed it did and so they practiced as restoration of the early church
Tyler Lee Price
They can practice it all they want, but DOES IT DEFINE PENTECOSTALISM?
Varnel Watson
Tyler Lee Price so you are a better Pentecostal than the early church and the early Pentecostals 🙂 Good night
Tyler Lee Price
That’s not what I said. I’m asking you the question “does foot washing define Pentecostalism?” The answer is no. Spirit empowered ministry and personal holiness does. A person with a view of meticulous providence can be just as Pentecostal as an open theist or a molinist.
Darryl Forbes
Concerning communion Jesus said “as often as he do this…” so the three month time frame is not specifically backed up by scripture. Some will say monthly is required. Others specify no particular time frame. So I don’t think the 3 months time limit determines whether one is biblically obedient or not
Varnel Watson
true – its just an example but if you waint had it for 3 months then its for sure BTW some early saints took communion daily and some early Pentecostals upon revelation from the Spirit