Concerning the evidence of Speaking in tongues

Concerning the evidence of Speaking in tongues
Posted by in Facebook's Pentecostal Theology Group View the Original Post

Concerning the evidence of Speaking in tongues: The scripture tread the mouth and the lip as the index of the heart, and the tongue is one of the most unruly, and speaks out of the fullness of heart. If the heart is full of sin, it will speak sin, and if the heart is filled with the Holy Spirit, it will speak Holy Spirit. As the Spirit fills the heart, the tongue speaks what is in the heart.

 

Concerning eternal security: This is a bad terms, because it implies that we say today that God forgave our past, present and future sin. This is true, but we must be careful not to say on this bases “Once saved, always saved”. God is always relational.

 

Alexander:

We have lost Wesley’s concept of assurance. Assurance was the foremost concern of Wesley. He had no assurance of his own faith, because it was no concept in the Anglican tradition. That was a crises in Wesley.

Wesley: Assurance is the perception of the Spirit’s work (a Spirit’s work), and every person should be able to know assurance.

The 19th century holiness movement Phoebe Palmer, she was the leader in the holiness, and of the Wesleyan tradition. She changed the idea of assurance, and through that Wesleyan Theology becomes more Calvinistic.

Phoebe introduced a shorter way: (also called altar theology, because it all happens at the altar)

  1. entire consecration
  2. faith
  3. testimony

At the altar you receive entire consecration, receive faith and get up and testify, and act on your faith. That short-circuits sanctification as a processed. That was a shortcut and a roadblock in Pentecostal theology.

 

Finished Work: Durham (1910) preaches finished work. Durham collapses everything – except the baptism of the Holy Spirit – is the finished work, it is positional theology.

That is a detour because it keeps people from understanding that God is interested with more than just forgiving of sin.

 

Healing: We have two sides, the Wesleyan theology and the finished work side.

They have a lot in common, healing as a sign, healing in atonement.

They differ how healing is appropriated.

  • The finished work: healing is always a looking back to Calvary.
  • Wesleyan: healing is always a looking forwards as a sign of the kingdom to come.

Flowrence: (1917) think health, act health, and be healthy.(This was positional theology)

 

Over-realized eschatology is also a roadblock, because it looks to much to the future and brings it the presence.

Gause:

There can not be entire sanctification, except by death. Our death becomes a necessity for our sanctification. We must be careful not to have a dualism, and embrace a positional point in which we believe to entire sanctification as received at one point.

The Wesleyan forward look: Healing is participation in resurrection.

Healing is not a guarantee, that we don’t die, but healing is a participation in resurrection.

We have to hold in tension, which is healing and dying.

 

Eternal security. (Once saved, always saved)

Hebr.6.1-6: They argue with this scripture, that it is not possible to backslide, because once saved, and backslide, it is not possible to be saved again. They argued if somebody “backslide”, that they actually had not tasted salvation. But: Christ tasted death: Greek – taste is much stronger.

Conversion is tasting in Jesus, and there is nothing that someone seems only to be saved, in order to justify a scripture for eternal security.

It is possible to fall from grace. But why is this passage of Hebr.6.1-6 so severe. The background is that it talks about Jewish believers, who return to Judaism, and had to denounce Christ as from the devil, that also applies to the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

We are far more secure in the love of God, that we ever imagined.

 

10 Comments

  • Jeremiah Burton
    Reply November 24, 2019

    Jeremiah Burton

    Great read, but did I’m miss something? Did it ever get to the evidence of Speaking in Tongues?

  • Troy Day
    Reply November 24, 2019

    Troy Day

    Concerning the evidence of Speaking in tongues: The scripture tread the mouth and the lip as the index of the heart, and the tongue is one of the most unruly, and speaks out of the fullness of heart. If the heart is full of sin, it will speak sin, and if the heart is filled with the Holy Spirit, it will speak Holy Spirit. As the Spirit fills the heart, the tongue speaks what is in the heart.

    • Jeremiah Burton
      Reply November 24, 2019

      Jeremiah Burton

      Troy Day gotcha! I thought it was going to delve deeper than that. Thanks!

    • Troy Day
      Reply November 25, 2019

      Troy Day

      Jeremiah Burton that will be what we do in the discussions that follows How much deeper? You either speak in tongues or you dont 🙂 http://www.pentecostaltheology.com/?s=tongues

    • Jeremiah Burton
      Reply November 25, 2019

      Jeremiah Burton

      Lol! True, but I like how you broke down the evolution of OSAS from Wesley on. Something like the various perspectives on the topic within the scope of Pentecostal history and where we land on the topic today. Thanks!

    • Troy Day
      Reply November 25, 2019

      Troy Day

      Jeremiah Burton do you need to be saved to speak in tongues OR do you have to speak in tongues to be saved? OSAS is NOT a Pentecostal teaching

    • Jeremiah Burton
      Reply November 25, 2019

      Jeremiah Burton

      Troy Day I Agree that OSAS is not a Pentecostal teaching and I don’t agree with the doctrine. So, I’m not looking for clarification on that, more so on the other perspectives on the issue of the Evidence of Speaking in tongues. TBH, I have gone back and forth on the issue as it pertains to its requirement for salvation and would like to hear (read) some other perspectives and historical views on the topic. I’m currently of the position that is not a requirement for salvation, but does serve as the initiatives evidence. Thanks!

  • Tim Law
    Reply November 25, 2019

    Tim Law

    I pray in tongues every day.

  • Troy Day
    Reply November 25, 2019

    Troy Day

    Jeremiah Burton some still believe you need it to be saved I dont know – there are verse FOR that if you read them this way

    However, initial evidence is requirement for baptism IMO Many claimed to be baptized but dont speak tongues So are most baptist and so on bapticostals

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